Watching The Untrusted Implode

Chee Dale, Derbyshire, England, August 2015

Chee Dale, Derbyshire, England, August 2015

Jeremy Corbyn – Darling of the Untrusteds – I don’t think so.

I was intrigued to know how relevant Corbyn had been in the history of the Untrusteds so I did a quick search of my extensive archives and discovered but one mention of the man by Backtothepoint below a Guardian article – Paris mayor candidate promises lush makeovers for ghost metro stations:

Why do the Groan keep calling the Parti de Gauche/Parti Communiste/Front de Gauche “far left”?

Would they call Austin Mitchell or Jeremy Corbyn “far left”?

If they need an explanation of the politics of these parties and alliance, they have my e-mail address and I’d be delighted to put them straight.

So Jeremy Corbyn is middle of the road?

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More nonsense from Ann Tanner – AT42

Posting under a Kier Hardy election poster demanding among other things “Healthy Homes”, she writes:

I thought Kier Hardie’s programme was quite up to date.

Because most of those problems are once again relevant.

Instead of temperance reform perhaps just a change that prevents the naked profiteering that prioritises sales over safety.

Kier Hardie died in 1915 at a time before the massive progress in medical science,  when households were ravaged by the killer diseases  of Cholera, Smallpox, Influenza, Chicken pox, Diphtheria, and Polio, among others.

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Beautifulburnout
07/08/2015 at 11:29 pm

‘For the anitpathetic lurkers: why the f00k do you actually care or even thing about what I say? I am a mere speck of dust in an endless universe. Or maybe you think I am more important than that? Weirdos.’

Strange how this mere speck of dust can be so attractive to those who wouldn’t notice it if it fell on their heads like an avalanche:

Here she is, “this mere speck of dust” on the Untrusted site in September 2009, bragging about her celebrity associations:

One of my claims to fame is that Lesley Ash and Lee Chapman were neighbours of mine for a few months in France and we kind of got to know one another, (although I was a tad shy at pushing it too much in case they thought I was only being friendly because of who they were as opposed to just being a nice person). She would never have put up with all that WAG shit though.

It was when Lee went out to play for the local team Niort just when they were relegated to french div 2, which was a disaster. It was Cloughie who eventually just phoned them up one night, cos they were so pissed off and in a rubbish block of flats and hadn’t been paid, and hauled them out of there. I ended up selling their telly and washing machine for them.

13 September, 2009 22:17

I think Lee Chapman used to be a famous footballer and Ms Ash an actor.

Such exalted company for a mere speck of dust.

———————————————-

 A new set of photographs here,

(Photographs 27) all of which have been posted before but they’re now together in one place.

———————————————————

Make them eat everything

People who were picky eaters as children are more likely to develop depression and anxiety, researchers claim. They said this was the case whether the child was a severe fussy eater or only moderately so.

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Welcome to The Real Untrusted

for a brief introduction to this site – read here

“The citadel of established practice seldom falls to the polite knock of a good idea. It may however yield to a long siege, a pre-emptive strike, a wooden horse or a cunning alliance.” 

————————————————–

BeautifulBurnout on the Tower Hamlets school girls:

We still don’t have any proof that they have actually gone to fight with or support ISIL either, Frog. As I mentioned the other day, the elder sister of one of the girls seemed to think they had gone off to try and find their friend and bring her back.

The BBC news today, 4 July, reported that two of the three girls, fully covered and with a woman carrying a gun, had been filmed out shopping in Syria.

—————————————————————–

The Untrusted’s Ann Tanner – (AT42) posts:

I supposed its the government I am ashamed of – and they (mis)represent us to the world. Their policies drag our name in the dirt and then ordinary people pay with their lives as they did in Tunisia today.

And I supppose she said the same about the  7 July 2005 London bombings when Blair’s (and Tanner’s) Labour Party was in government and Ken Livingstone was London Mayor?

Maybe she should attend a few of the funerals of those slaughtered so she can explain to the grieving relatives how Islamic terrorism is all the responsibility of successive Labour and Conservative government policies.

And just to prove how degenerate she’s become, here’s the UT’s resident barrister  BeautifulBurnout in full agreement with the members of the homicidal child rapists of Islamic State –

Anne – you are spot on.

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End of You Tell Us – 28 January 2015

“Today is the last ideas thread. From tomorrow, we won’t be running these threads anymore. We still really want your ideas for articles, but we think the best way to do that will be to have a dedicated email address for people to send in suggestions. That is being set up asap. The editor of Cif, Kira Cochrane, will be running a talking shop tomorrow to explain more, but when this thread closes tomorrow there won’t be a new one. I know this will be upsetting for some, but please bear with us while we make some new changes to the site.”

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 Today’s Music

As from today – (sometime in early 2013) “A Change is gonna Come” and hence the track which is from almost 500, vaguely described as pop and rock, on my MP4 player that I use mainly when I’m running at the gym or outdoors, or when I’m doing things I rather not like ironing clothes, cleaning and so on. This one by coincidence comes top of the list when arranged in alphabetical order. Of course I’ll intersperse them with some great jazz and classical music

Today’s music.

Kronos Quartet – The Beatitudes

   —————————————————————————–

In the beginning……….. How the CiF rebels turned hypocrisy into an art form-  is now elsewhere  – making comments posted here easier to access – I hope.

To Comment click here & page to the bottom  

Leave a comment

14,336 Comments

  1. “…an isolated figure sitting in a bedsit in your unwashed pants, mouse in one hand, cock in the other, guiltily wanking your small life away and lashing out at the world.”

    aspire away big boy, but ya nothin’ but a dreamer. You shall go done in history as the man who said; “clean pants or death! I will die defending my clean, clean pants!”

    Reply
  2. Jack Roth

     /  September 4, 2015

    ‘When and if I want to pick fights I do it where there’s a somewhat bigger audience’

    You do yourself an injustice BTH, I think this site has a larger audience than its few contributors would suggest.

    Of course, if the cowards of The Guardian censors would have allowed links to here when YTU was up and running things may have been different – you have Mrs Cowpat and co to thank for that.

    You can take some small comfort from the fact that the second largest website in the world saw your opinions as such a threat to them that they banned any mention of this miniscule site.

    Reply
  3. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    Hi Desde yes pictures are powerful

    the world and the photographer forgot this child

    https://iconicphotos.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/kevin-carter-vulture.jpg?w=700&h=466

    Reply
  4. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    ‘British government refuses to accept refugees – British fanatics join Islamic State to make more refugees. What an example to the world we are’

    Nick Cohen

    Reply
    • Sara

       /  September 4, 2015

      “Take me to any country Leave me there Forget about me In the sea throw me Dont ask I have no choice”

      Syria song

  5. Jack Roth

     /  September 4, 2015

    Reply
    • Paul

       /  September 4, 2015

      I agree the wealthy Gulf states should be doing more to help the refugees Jack.But you also have to take into consideration the sheer physical distance between Syria and some of the Gulf states.So it kind of makes sense that they’re initially fleeing to countries like Turkey,Lebanon and Jordan which Syria shares borders with.

      That aside the Gulf states should at very least provide financial support for the huge numbers of Syrian refugees living in refugee camps in countries like Lebanon.which are struggling to cope.But even if Saudi Arabia and other wealthy countries in the Gulf relaxed their visa requirements and granted sanctuary to Syrian refugees would they accept? I might be wrong but many may feel safer in Europe and North America .And i can understand that.I may have mentioned it before but i’m friends with a number of people from Iran who were granted asylum in this country and going to another Arab country wasn’t on the agenda-especially given they’re educated ,secular and prefer the freedoms of the West.

      The following link is from the BBC and looks at why more Syrian refugees aren’t going to other wealthy Arab states.

      http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34132308

  6. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    A Norwegian bank issued this credit card, and didn’t spot anything wrong with the image http://www.timesofisrael.com/norwegian-bank-apologizes-for-anti-semitic-credit-card/

    Reply
    • Paul

       /  September 4, 2015

      Hi Sara

      It looks like something out of ”The Eternal Jew”-the nazi propaganda film made in 1940.Shameful.

  7. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    Unbelievable http://www.timesofisrael.com/tourists-pour-cold-water-on-auschwitz-showers/

    Auschwitz ‘showers’

    Israelis offended over installation of refreshing sprays for visitors at concentration camp

    ‘Recent visitors to the site of the Auschwitz-Birkenau Nazi concentration camp in Poland were alarmed to see sprinklers installed at the entrance of the site, where over a million Jews were killed in gas chambers disguised as shower rooms.

    While many refreshed themselves in the suspended pipes that sprayed a fine mist of cool water, Israeli visitors found the presence of “showers” at Auschwitz offensive.

    “Youth groups that were there didn’t really notice and treated it like fun, but for me it was déjà vu of the selection and extermination in the showers,” an Israeli visitor, Meir Bolka, told Channel 2 in a report published Monday. “People came by and had a shower.”

    Bolka took his misgivings to the main office at the site and told an employee of his concerns over the arrangement.

    “She said that it was the solution that they found to cool off because of the heat,” he recalled.

    Temperatures in the region recently reached 37°C (98.6º F).

    “She of course apologized that it made me feel that way, but beyond that they didn’t do anything,” Bolka said.

    One million European Jews were murdered at Auschwitz-Birkenau, which was set up by Nazi Germany in occupied Poland in 1940-1945. More than 100,000 others, including non-Jewish Poles, Roma, Soviet prisoners of war and anti-Nazi resistance fighters, also died there, according to the museum.

    Some prisoners were forced to enter gas chambers disguised as shower rooms, where poisonous gas was inserted through holes in the ceiling, killing the occupants.’

    Reply
  8. Paul

     /  September 4, 2015

    Michael Ward ,a 59 year old man declared fit for work and ineligible for ESA following his WCA but also ineligible for JSA because he’s not fit enough to actively seek work.Growing numbers of people are finding themselves in this category and they’re not being tracked by the DWP.So no one knows what’s happening to them,.how many have died etc .

    http://www.halifaxcourier.co.uk/news/calderdale/man-with-leukaemia-told-he-must-find-work-1-7443868

    Reply
  9. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    How to identify the birds in your garden

    Reply
  10. Sara

     /  September 4, 2015

    Loving the look on Liz & Yvette’s faces when Mascara man explains when the times right for a female leader

    Reply
  11. Paul

     /  September 4, 2015

    Hello all

    Bitey-i like that picture of Chee Dale in Derbyshire- another part of the country i’ve never visited.Although i seem to remember Edwina Currie represented part of it during her parliamentary career which can’t have done its tourist industry any good.

    Regarding the UT and Corbyn i can’t remember any discussion putting him forward as their ideal leader of the Labour party. But i concede i may well have missed it given i didn’t religiously read each thread .And as far as Pointy implying that Jeremy Corbyn was”middle of the road”i don’t think he knows his arse from his elbow let alone his left from his right.So his comment is probably best taken with a pinch of salt.Although i’d be interested to know whether you e-mailed him as he invited people to do .And whether he replied .And if he did reply were you any the wiser of what he was on about. :-)

    Reply
  12. Good morning all.

    Nearly had a fire in the kitchen yesterday – put a baguette in the microwave as the hob’s not working and it started smoking and the kitchen was filling with smoke. I flung the offending piece of bread out of the window. Lucky then that I’m living in a house with a garden and some hapless passerby didn’t get clobbered by a flying piece of garlic scented charcoal.

    Reply
    • Paul

       /  September 4, 2015

      put a baguette in the microwave

      Desde,are you trying to single-handedly destroy the Entente Cordiale ? :-)

  13. JimPress

     /  September 4, 2015

    Bitey, I seem to recall you saying a few months back that you wouldn’t tolerate people being gratuitously abusive to others.

    I believe your comments were in relation to Jack’s good friend and confidante Ity. Now that Jack’s purpose here appears to amount to no more than being a papal emissary of stupidity and hate, perhaps it’s time to kick him into touch. Or, failing that, maybe we could all just ignore him and let him rant in devout isolation.

    In the past there’s been a lot of criticism of the unwillingness of the regulars over at Montana’s place to take a firm stand against their racists, Jew-baiters and rape apologists. We could set them an example by standing with Sara (who Jack seems oddly fixated on) and giving a big collective fuck you to the piece of filth formerly known as 101.

    Reply
    • Jack Roth

       /  September 4, 2015

      A poor effort, Jim.

      It looks like your best work is behind you mate.

      Sad really.

    • more than sad…a tragedy. Tragedy encompassed in a single human form.

    • Hi Jim,

      Well I can’t recall saying I wouldn’t tolerate abuse although I have said I don’t like foul language here or anywhere else but that’s because I can’t see the point when it’s perfectly possible to say what you want without it. And I’ve only ever used it when I’m quoting someone else’s post.

      However this is the only part of the site that’s open for comments and I have neither the inclination or intention to police it. As I said once to James Dixon when he turned up here:

      So the only thing I had in mind when I set up this site was to have somewhere to record my own observations, but not to manage a chat-room :)

      This is why there’s only one page open for comments where on occasion I’ll post one myself.

    • Sara

       /  September 4, 2015

      Hi Jim _ I thinks it’s best to challenge Jack

    • Sara

       /  September 4, 2015

      ‘I have neither the inclination or intention to police it.’

      Fair enough – but opinions are always good ..no?

    • Sara

       /  September 4, 2015

      bth – and just becase jack doesn’t stick an x in his comments – doesnt mean they shouldnt be shredded to pieces.

      what are your thoughts?

    • Hi Sara,

      what are your thoughts?

      I think that people will have different views on refugees and abortion and they will also be abusive towards each other, but I’m not inclined to join in here. As I’ve said before, it’s not why this place exists.

      When and if I want to pick fights I do it where there’s a somewhat bigger audience, like when some populist gets several hundred recommends on a CiF thread.

    • Sara

       /  September 4, 2015

      sticks an x in his coments i meant

    • JimPress

       /  September 4, 2015

      Of course it’s your call Sara, but engaging with a guy who combines the fatuity of Pagey with the politics of the Pope seems like a recipe for disaster.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 4, 2015

      Come on, Jim – you can do better than this.

      Its like watching a once-great champ stepping back in the ring, all flabby and punch-drunk.

      Embarrassing.

    • JimPress

       /  September 4, 2015

      Nothing good comes from a mismatch Jack.

      Slapping you around a ring would be a bleak hollow victory. I never had the stomach to rough up the genuine inadequates at CIF and I’m not going to head down that path with you here.

      Peter B got to the heart of it this week when he alluded to the bitterness that often afflicts the lonely. Despite your claims to the contrary, everybody views you as an isolated figure sitting in a bedsit in your unwashed pants, mouse in one hand, cock in the other, guiltily wanking your small life away and lashing out at the world.

      You exist in the same bleak dog-fucking twilight zone as Shazz and Ity (maybe you are Shazz and Ity) where the only solace comes from trolling for attention online.

      This is the last bit of direct attention you’ll get from me.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 4, 2015

      Gotcha, Jim, I admired your work, but I always knew I was was better.

  14. A track for Aylan, Galip and their mum RIP

    And i hope the Dad is able to get over his grief.Like most dads he was probably doing what he felt was best for his family and he shouldn’t be held responsible for their deaths.None of us iare in a position to judge so should refrain from doing so.

    Reply
  15. Sara

     /  September 3, 2015

    ‘Absolutely tragic, Paul. ‘

    why lie jack – ? you have no care for the baby that died – and if you have children and dismiss lives like this, well I can’t believe you do – and im struggling to think you are a real person

    Reply
    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      EVERYONE is sad because a photo has emerged of a thing that has been happening several times a week for months.

      It has been confirmed that everyone kind of knew the thing was happening, but now they are very sad and angry because there is a photo of it.

      Martin Bishop, from Hatfield, said: “If only there wasn’t a photo of the thing that’s been happening for months, I wouldn’t have to care about it.

      “But, according to the rules, now that there’s a photo of the thing we all kind of knew was happening, something must be done.

      “And don’t show me any more photos.”

      – The Mash.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      would the children in Syria – who have had chemial weapons reined on them count more? you are so out of order jack it is sick

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      You are hopelessly confused, Sara – two children are dead because their chancer father tried his arm – yet hes a hero, and i’m ‘sick’.

      Stop making an idiot of yourself lady.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      Oh, and btw, Sara – the mother (who also died) didn’t want to take this ‘voyage’, Of course, you no doubt still blame me and ‘bed-rockets’ for the death of these children – nothing to do with the father.

      You really are a Useful Idiot I’m afraid.

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3221712/I-m-scared-water-Mother-drowned-two-sons-told-relative-did-not-want-attempt-crossing-Greece-boat-sank-Turkey.html

    • Hello Jack

      Visual images are very powerful – we are confronted with the reality of what’s happening. Refugees have been dying for a long time but we didn’t have such a raw piece of newsreel as that of the police officer carrying a 3 year old’s dead body. When it is seen across the world there’s shock and horror but it was happening anyway. We don’t see photos of the dead due to the WCAs, benefit sanctions, long waiting lists for mental health services and other cuts – sometimes we hear the names of those who died but often not even that. If we saw the dead bodies of those who’ve committed suicide after losing their ESA benefit or could see their suicide note we might be moved to act and do something more about it. Not that there aren’t people trying to do something but an awful lot of Britons are oblivious to it.

  16. Sara

     /  September 3, 2015

    jack ‘Two children are dead, Sara – and you don’t think we should ask questions?’

    You do realise they fled from Turkey Jack yes? you know the country that has persecuted Kurds and is bombing more Kurdish freedom fighters than IS.

    You’re shameful

    Reply
    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘You do realise they fled from Turkey Jack yes? you know the country that has persecuted Kurds’

      He PAID to go to Turkey, the family had been there for over a year.

      There is something seriously wrong with you Sara.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘There is something seriously wrong with you Sara.’

      No Jack.. there is something seriously wrong with you

    • Hi Sara and Jack

      Jack-the family may not have felt safe in Turkey what with ISIS being across the border in Syria and Turkey using the situation with ISIS as a smokescreen to attack the Kurds in Northern Iraq..So there may well be a lot of tension in Turkey and from what i understand the family ultimately wanted to go to Canada.And of course we know nothing of the conditions they were living in whilst refugees in Turkey. For as i’m sure you must know the Turks don’t have a good record with regard to human rights and that may include the human rights of refugees in their country.

      Maybe the family were desperate and saw getting to Kos as a step towards making them safer as well as being one step closer to their dream of getting to Canada.I don’t think anyone should judge them for making that decision despite the tragic consequences.For any of us may have taken the same risk if we were in their shoes.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘ They fled from Turkey … you know the country that has persecuted Kurds and is bombing … Kurdish freedom fighters’

      The family had been living in Istanbul for over a year – were the Turkish Air Force bombing this family there?

      They were in a safe place – the father paid people smugglers to ferry them to Kos, he put his two children in an over-crowded inflatable dinghy, in the pitch black and without life-jackets – and you blame the Turkish Air Force and absolve him of all responsibility – and call those who question this ‘shameless’.

      You’re either a troll or an idiot.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘You’re either a troll or an idiot.’

      I feel sick for the loss of all the lives of the people and children who have died jack, if that makes me an ‘idiot or a troll’ ..well go to hell you fucking nasty piece of work

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘I feel sick for the loss of all the lives of the people and children who have died jack,’

      We all do, but you, Sara, instead of putting the blame for the tragedy were it belongs, are using the deaths of these children to make political capital.

      Now that is ‘shameless’.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      And keep your nastiness for yourself jack, from your safe comfy British home,. on the lengths desperate refugees go to save their families, their father stayed in the water for 3 hours looking for his sons, – these two young boys bodies arn’t even cold and you are trying to score points on their deaths

      shameless

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘We all do, but you, Sara, instead of putting the blame for the tragedy were it belongs, are using the deaths of these children to make political capital.’

      Are you actually trying to blame the Father Jack?

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘Maybe the family were desperate ‘
      Of course they were desperate – no maybe about it

    • Jack

      Sara has been absolutely absolutely consistent in her views on the plight of the Syrian refugees.

      And Turkey may well have been the only country this particular family could get to in their quest to get to Canada.You really need to see the bigger picture .

      Implying the parents were to blame for the death of their little son is really harsh.You need to understand that desperate people sometimes resort to desperate measures.And maybe the parents felt unsafe in Turkey and were desperate to get out.

      None of us are in a position to judge them.

    • Sara

      Of course they were desperate – no maybe about it

      I was trying to get Jack to see things from the perspective of the family.No need to bite my head off online stylee.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘No need to bite my head off online stylee.’

      Hi Paul – I wasn’t biting your head off, sorry if it came across like that – just so sick of reading these btl comments on the guardian and elsewhere.. and now jack is continuing – when has he stopped recently.. it’s just getting .. well

    • Sorry Sara my post also came across as more serious than i’d intended it to be .I still love you. :-)

      It’s a highly emotive issue and i can understand you feeling strongly about it.As i said earlier you’ve been absolutely consistent in your views on this.And i think you were the first to raise the plight of the refugees in Syria on YTU.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      Sorry, Paul – he wasn’t being persecuted in Turkey and he wasn’t being bombed in his Istanbul bed by the air force (despite what Sara insists).

      The truth of the matter is he wasn’t willing to wait in the queue for a Turkish exit visa (the Turkish authorities are overwhelmed, and it can take a year to get one).

      As a direct consequence of his refusal to abide by rules of the host country that gave his family sanctuary, two children are dead.

      So, you tell me where the blame lies.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      least some of us can feel some love and empathy paul, hope all well with you

  17. I can’t get the haunting image of that lifeless little Syrian boy lying face down on the beach out of my head.Rest in peace little one.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/if-these-extraordinarily-powerful-images-of-a-dead-syrian-child-washed-up-on-a-beach-dont-change-europes-attitude-to-refugees-what-will-10482757.html

    Reply
    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      Me neither Paul – sadly there are thousands more lifeless haunting pictures of dead Syrian children, they have been dying for the past four years – the world looked away, Ed Miliband looked away, Obama looked away, huge sections of the left remained mute, the right said nothing
      The comments btl on the Guardian regarding the desperate plight of these refugees stink.

      What a world we live in

      ”No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friend’s or of thine own were: any man’s death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee.”

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      Absolutely tragic, Paul.

      But (and its a big but) they were already in Turkey (and had been for some time), and Bodrum is a tourist hot spot and is a safe haven – Why did the family put the boy in a boat, with-out a life jacket, at night, to go across the way to Kos?

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘Absolutely tragic, Paul.

      But (and its a big but) they were already in Turkey (and had been for some time), and Bodrum is a tourist hot spot and is a safe haven – Why did the family put the boy in a boat, with-out a life jacket, at night, to go across the way to Kos?’

      you have no shame Jack.. none at all

      Aylan and his brother Galip – May you both rest in Peace

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘you have no shame Jack.. none at all’

      Two children are dead, Sara – and you don’t think we should ask questions?

  18. Afternoon all

    As the saying goes ”Knowledge Is Power ” and that’s never more true when ordinary people try and fight for their rights in this country.

    Legal Aid has been cut as has the funding for the CAB and Law Centres which are now over-stretched and can’t meet the demands which are placed upon them.So unless people can pay for legal advice or are able to do their own homework the potential for them failing to get justice significantly increases.

    It’s been long established that people appealing against decisions made by the DWP concerning their benefit entitlement have a much better chance of succeeding if they’re represented.And this has been proven by a group of legal volunteers in Bristol who’re claiming a 95% success rate for their clients.Yet what about those who have a good case and who either can’t get someone to represent them or can’t effectively represent themselves ? What happens to them if/when they lose their appeals ?

    The recent DWP stats on the deaths of disability claimants showed that as well as the 2380 who died after being declared ”Fit For Work” and the 7200 who died after being declared ”Fit For Work Related Activity” a further 1360 died after losing their appeals.And i wonder how many of them had representation ?.For whilst they may well have still died soon after winning their appeals it’s possible-indeed i’d say probable-that if all these people had representation at their appeals many more of them would have been successful.And possibly some of them may and i stress may- have lived longer.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/legal-advice-centre-helps-95-of-people-declared-fit-to-work-by-dwp-get-decision-overturned-10482768.html.

    Reply
    • And yet you are a pro austerity Andy Burnham supporter, no?

    • Interesting article from the Void about the stats on ESA claimants who’ve died.I haven’t had time to look at the stats in any depth but It seems they may have been wrongly interpreted by much of the media .They are however still shocking..And as the article points out no-one’s tracking what happens to those who’re either declared ineligible for ESA or who voluntarily give up their claims but who neither find work nor go on to claim any other benefits.How many of them have died ?

      https://johnnyvoid.wordpress.com/2015/08/28/these-statistics-tell-us-fuck-all-but-one-death-was-too-many/

    • Some CABs have been criticised for taking corporate money after losing lots of council funding but they are doing what they have to to survive. They have now been rebranded and are the Citizens Advice without the Bureau tag. Before the legal aid cuts as you say, solicitors used to hold lots of free sessions at the CAB offices specialising in different areas of the law which was very useful. Now, if a client is referred to a solicitor after being assessed and having an adviser interview they get one meeting with a solicitor and that’s it, after that they have to pay. All the Citizen’s Advice are separate charities in their own right but most are having to do the same in relation to cutting back the help they can offer.

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      Well, Ity – as the document in question refers to the Nazis only as ‘goyim, I’d say they have a fair point in calling them ‘evil’ (to say the least) – wouldn’t you?

      Hope that helps.

    • It also says:

      A spokesperson for Beis Rochel said that the worksheets would be amended and apologised for any offence. However they argued the phrase “goyim” was not offensive and accusations that they were indoctrinating children were “without basis”. “The language we used was not in any way intended to cause offence, now this has been brought to our attention, we will endeavour to use more precise language in the future.”

    • goyim
      1. A Hebrew word used in the Jewish Scriptures (a.k.a. the Old Testament). The word literally means “nations,” and is always used within these scriptures to refer to the nations of the world. Significantly, within the Old Testament, Judah (the Jewish nation) itself is called a “goy.”
      2. In the Old Testament, the Jews were called to be a nation separate from the other nations, which were all Pagan. And so, colloquially, all non-Jewish nations came to be called “goyim” as in “the nations” from which the God of the Old Testament had called upon the Jews to separate themselves.
      3. A word used by some Jews to refer to Gentiles (non-Jews). The word can have derogatory connotations, such as the word “black” when used to refer to a persons of African descent. It can be neutral or negative depending on the context and the intent of the speaker.

      Singular = goy

    • That was a random pick of definitions thrown up by google, though feel free to point to other definitions of ‘goyim’ if so desired.

    • and jack, we are talking about 3 year old children here. What sort of adult thinks it appropriate to be putting this sort of poison into a childs head? 3 years old jack.

      3 YEARS OLD!

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      What part of ‘the document in question refers to the Nazis only as ‘goyim,’ don’t you understand Ity? …. unless you don’t consider the Nazis evil of course.

    • Now see here jack. Look at this ‘argument’ that you have just deployed. Oh wait, hang on, it isn’t an argument at all. it’s just you being deliberately obtuse to try and cloud a clear point. I’m feeling disinclined to engage you in further discussion to be honest…hey ho, shall we limp on?

      So. Back to the 3 year old. They are told non jew = goyim. And also Nazi = goyim.

      There is potential for some misunderstanding here, especially to a 3 year old.

    • It’s obviously up to you Jack but i wouldn’t waste your time engaging with that twat.

    • “…unless you don’t consider the Nazis evil of course.”

      And do I really need to qualify that I think that a Nazi is not a nice person? I hesitate to use the word evil as I don’t think it helpful. The word ‘evil’ allows people of the hook to easily, allows the possibility of us forgetting these things can happen again. It is people who commit acts so atrocious that get called evil. But they are still people behaving badly.

      This thing of making people ‘other’ allows atrocity to happen. But teaching 3 year olds to fear and hate creates this very divide of us and them, this us and ‘other’, surely?

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘It’s obviously up to you Jack but i wouldn’t waste your time engaging with that tw*t.’

      Anti-Semitic scum shouldn’t go unchallenged, Paul – but I take your point.

    • .It’s obviously up to you Jack but i wouldn’t waste your time engaging with that twat.

      Well really! Your manners are atrocious, I hope your mother washes your mouth out and sends you to bed with a sock in it.

    • So jack, I’m Anti-Semitic scum now? I would be grateful if you could show your workings.

    • Jack…

      …go unchallenged, ha! don’t make me laugh.

      I challenge you to justify the line of argument that you have used here today, in trying to avoid a tricky truth. I don’t think you are that dumb, which only leaves intentional obfuscation. You are dishonest to the core.

  19. Sara

     /  September 3, 2015

    j

    ‘Some of us are going to leave, however, not because the far left is left-wing, but because it is a dangerous and often filthy reactionary force. If you need me to explain, consider that left-wingers are always denouncing the Tories and Ukip supporters as racists/sexists/homophobes, occasionally with justice. Then they elect as their leader a man David Cameron or even Nigel Farage would expel from their parties for:

    Appearing on the propaganda stations of Iran, a theocracy that oppresses women, homosexuals, trade unionists and the Sunni and Kurdish religious and ethnic minorities, and appearing on the stations of Russia, an imperial power, which shows no more respect for international borders than it does for gay rights. When I discuss these matters, Corbyn supporters huff that their man is ‘engaging’. To date they have been unable to provide me with one example of Corbyn raising his tremulous voice to protest about the human rights abuses of his gruesome hosts.

    Welcoming and campaigning for a variety of Arab and white anti-Semites, including outright fascists who deny the holocaust. These gentlemen not only want to kill Jews but to oppress every progressive force in the Middle East, from feminists to free thinkers. Once again his supporters play the engagement card. Once again they have failed to produce one scrap of evidence that Corbyn has challenged the prejudices of his allies. It seems racism does not matter if its targets are Jews. Feminism does not cover women with brown skins. Warmongering is acceptable if the mongers in question are killing British troops.

    In other words, in the affairs of the world, Labour under Corbyn will be well to the right of the Tories. Thousands will leave for that reason alone, not least because they will find the hypocrisy too great to stomach.

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/nick-cohen/2015/09/labours-centrists-hold-white-flag-surrender/

    Reply
    • Thanks for the post Sara and it goes a long way to explaining why Labour Party membership has never been an attractive proposition for me, despite voting for its candidates all my life.

      ‘Some of us are going to leave, however, not because the far left is left-wing, but because it is a dangerous and often filthy reactionary force. If you need me to explain, consider that left-wingers are always denouncing the Tories and Ukip supporters as racists/sexists/homophobes, occasionally with justice. Then they elect as their leader a man David Cameron or even Nigel Farage would expel from their parties for:

      Appearing on the propaganda stations of Iran, a theocracy that oppresses women, homosexuals, trade unionists and the Sunni and Kurdish religious and ethnic minorities, and appearing on the stations of Russia, an imperial power, which shows no more respect for international borders than it does for gay rights. When I discuss these matters, Corbyn supporters huff that their man is ‘engaging’. To date they have been unable to provide me with one example of Corbyn raising his tremulous voice to protest about the human rights abuses of his gruesome hosts.

  20. Sara

     /  September 3, 2015

    .
    AT42
    01/09/2015 at 2:08 pm

    ‘Absolutely what was done to Bin Laden makes those who ordered his killing (instead of his arrest) no better than he was.

    But we are not are we?

    Does anybody really think if Sadam(ghastly as he was) was still in power in Iraq we would have the nightmare situation in the middle East?

    The whole show was based on lies from weapons of mass destruction to claiming Iraq was a hotbed of Al Qaida .

    The latter claim would be laughable if the result of our action was not so disastrous
    Sadam was opposed to Al Qaida.

    What we got was so called I S – we made things worse not better

    The there’s Lybia !!
    There is pattern to this, Interventions in the ME, South America everywhere they tried to control the regime in the interests of Corporatism.’
    ————————————————————————————————-

    You really are one dumb apologist anne – and what’s worse..you can’t even see it – you’d have been quite content to leave Iraqi’s secularists and democrats to their tortuting fate under the sick, sadistic Baa’thist butcher that was Hussein – and content to let Hussein continue his genocidal campaigns againt the Kurds..you also seem to have no idea that Hussein and Assad nurtured Islamists..

    Hussein approved amputation of the tongue for ‘slander’ against ‘the president’ in the 199o’s – your tongue would have been so far up his backside – you would have had nothing to fear

    Reply
    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘The whole show was based on lies from weapons of mass destruction to claiming Iraq was a hotbed of Al Qaida’

      why dont you ask the Kurds about Husseins weapons of mass destruction in the ‘show’ that was Halabja

  21. Jack Roth

     /  September 2, 2015

    ‘Let manual workers retire earlier than people in office jobs, says leadership favourite Jeremy Corbyn’

    Ideas like this is why Corbyn is going to walk it.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3219623/Let-manual-workers-retire-earlier-people-office-jobs-says-66-year-old-Labour-leadership-favourite-Jeremy-Corbyn.html?offset=0&max=100&reply=97622995&jumpTo=comment-97622995#comment-97622995

    Reply
    • Sara

       /  September 2, 2015

      what would you do about the refugees fleeing persecution in Syria and beyond Jack?

    • Hi Sara,

      YouGov has just sent out a survey that ends with the question “Would you accept into your home for a year, a refugee from Syria, etc (I paraphrase) Yes No Don’t Know.

      Someone on the BBC Radio 4 Today suggested that if every local authority in the UK accepted 10 refugee families, and the rest of the EU did the same, that would resolve the problem.

      But how long would anyone stay in Sunderland or Workington or Hull or Swansea?

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 2, 2015

      Well, Sara – I think we should demonstrate that we can sort our own problems out, before we delude ourselves we can solve the worlds problems.

    • Sara

       /  September 2, 2015

      thought you’d say that jack

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 2, 2015

      ‘thought you’d say that jack’

      Then why ask ;-)

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘why ask’

      cos you’re nothing but a little Englander Jack

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘cos you’re nothing but a little Englander Jack’

      Not sure what you mean by that Sara. Aren’t you always telling us just how difficult it is to find somewhere to live? If we allow 100,000’s of these people into the UK, where are they going to live – where will you live?

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘Not sure what you mean by that Sara.’

      I mean your humanity stinks

    • Jack Roth

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘I mean your humanity stinks’

      You didn’t answer the question, heres a quote from somebody –

      there are two homeless men who sleep under the main railway bridge under Brighton Station – and have been there a long time – I pass them many days, it’s a really busy area – and commuters rush back and forth.. yet there they are – almost invisible, they have it set up with their sleeping bags and a few bits and pieces hanging from the pigeon rails above them – they go out in the day for a few hours – and leave their stuff there, including the tiny bowl with a few coins in, they never beg and they don’t have notices, sometimes have a dog with them. Why in all this time have they not be given accomadation

      Are you going to ask these two homeless guys to budge-up to make room for the 100,000’s (you think should come here) to join them under the bridge – tell us all again, Sara, how easy you found it to find accommodation.

      Still waiting for an answer Sara.

    • Sara

       /  September 3, 2015

      ‘Are you going to ask these two homeless guys to budge-up to make room for the 100,000’s (you think should come here) to join them under the bridge – tell us all again, Sara, how easy you found it to find accommodation. ‘

      What the hell are you talking about Jack? what has concern for homeless people in Brighton(or anywhere else ) got to do with desperate war torn refugees needing immediate sanctuary? children are the biggest casualties in Syria – and all you can do is try and score cheap points on the backs of washed up dead children .. For years I have been posting about Syria, about wanting something to be done.. your humanity stinks jack

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